17' 0" Freedom

[Joan and Ted]

Use this forum to post information specific to your 17' 0" Freedom project. Use POST REPLY when posting information. Please stay on topic. For general boatbuilding discussions, please use the Builders Forum instead.

[Michael_4]

A short introduction as the project is in it's earliest stages.

A first time canoe builder who with some good advice from several folks finally settled on the Freedom 17. Plans are in hand and the material is being sent as I write this by Great Northern Craft in Vancouver. They have been pleasent to deal with and I am confident I'll be very pleased with the quality of the planking.

While construction costs are casually quoted between the $900 to $1,400 to this point I have spent just a little over $2,000. Still outstanding are the thwarts, seats and the material for the decking. Also ofcourse, there is the cost of material for the forms and the strongback. I expect, when all said and done, including paddles, and a few good new tools like a REALLY good jig saw, Orbital sander and 30 some odd clamps, the actual cost of the project will be breathtakingly close to $3,000.

I have found the postings in the Builders Forum very interesting and as I start the process of building the canoe in my head I have found the topics either appease a worry that I have OR create one that I haven't yet thought about...depending on the subject. (chuckling)

I am expecting to actually make my 'start' in early October. The kit should be arriving this week and I'll spend some time just organizing my materials, tools ect. I hope to have the canoe planked before freeze up which is usually early in December as the garage is unheated. I don't mind the cold but I'm worried about glue not setting correctly. It is my intention to use the stapleless method as described in the latest edition of Canoecraft.

During the depths of winter I thought I'd expediate the process by making my decking and constructing the seating. Ideally, then it will be all ready to put in place when the time comes in the spring. Hopefully the weather will be just right here in Ottawa by late March early April to begin the fiberglassing.

I've heard that cherry makes for the nicest gunnels...so i've selected full lengths of that for this purpose. I hope this proves to be a good choice. I also bought the graphite for the West Coast System though just for the first time tonight saw what it looks like applied courtesy of someone who very kindly posted a picture. I didn't realize it made such a dramatic difference in the appearance. Then again, a beat up bottom doesn't look pretty either. Fortunately there is a lot of time before that become THE problem I have to think about.

Certainly my head has been filled with many a happy thought as I catch myself daydreaming. I'd welcome anyone else who has either successfully built this canoe or is about to start to contribute to this thread.

Let the adventure begin!!

Michael_4

(really just Michael but couldn't register with that)

[patrickdoty]

I myself built a freedom 17'9 but strectched her out a little and ended up with a boat 18'4''. check out my site http://studentweb.uwstout.edu/dotyp/scootywhoopin.htm
I built mine for 800 dollars, and used it all summer with no major signs of wear......
I work as a canoe guide at a ymca camp in northern Mn where we actually build some of our own boats. They started the program before i was there and now have 4 cedar boats in the fleet, and this is on top of our 24 wood-canvas boats. I noticed your considering putting the graphite on your boat. At camp our canoemaster put it on our boats because when they are used on our trips they tend to find canoe eaters every once and a while. We treat our boats with more respect than anyone you will meet, but strippers need more TLC than woodcanvas boats sometimes. So about your graphite, my advice to you is to weigh your intended use compared to visual appeal. Once you put that black graphite on your canoe your going to miss the beautiful wood your comvering up........
I myself have 5 oz cloth from RAKA, and west system epoxy which stood up beautifully to numerous run-ins with hidden boundary waters boulders.....i didnt have a single scratch that wasnt fixed with abother thin coat of varnish.....
Anyways, good luck with the project!

[Chris]

Hello,
I´m from Germany and I just started to build a Freedom 17. The strongback is finished and I started to put on the Molds. Looking forward to get an idea of the look when the molds are finished.

Best regards

Chris

[Chris]

Hello there,

just finished the strongback and the setup the molds. Everythings looks (nearly) fine :lol: ..

I`ve been to my dealer and bought really beautifully machined western red cedar strips and build some claps for the staplesless method of planking. Now I`m worrng about the type of glue. In "Canoecraft" is an type of carpenters glue recommended. My dealer (which is a professional boatbulider) told me to use West systems Epoxy with 407 filler for glueing the planks, because of the better perfomance of the epoxy in terms of strongness of the hull (My last english lesse was in 1986 - I hope you get me right....).


What do you thing about using epoxy? I thought It´s maybe nicer to work with a carpenters glue?

Thanks and best regards from Germany

Chris

[Glen Smith]

Hi Chris, for all of the stripping the use of a carpenter's glue is just fine and it is the "standard" glue for this job. Using a thickened epoxy for strip gluing will add frustration, time, weight and cost to the project. The standard "yellow carpenter's glue" is economical, easy to clean off the excess, easy to scrape and sand, sets in a reasonable time, requires no mixing and possible ratio errors and is strong enough for the purpose.

[Chris]

Hello Glen,

thanks a lot for your information.

I´ve been looking around for carpenters glue, but common is here in Germany a "white glue" which maybe looks not so nice for the relativ dark cedarwood?

In the internet I found a" PU Wood Glue" which should be brown, but I never saw it in a shop. I will look tomorow in another shop - maybe I have to use epoxy - but I´m NOT looking forwar to plamking with gloves, mixing the resin with filler.... and so on :-(

This evening I shaped about 10 or 12cm of the stems and installed them an the stemmoulds, after that I fixed all of the moulds with a long plank all over the top. Now I have two questions for going on:

1. The stems looks now a little bit unfair (I had faired the mould before surely :-)). Shall I look now for the inner stem to be fair, or is it just no problem because of the following shapes I have to make, when I start plankig?

2. The first plank....
I just noticed, that it was maybe not a good idea to cut all moulds at the sheerline - as drawn in the plans. There was no hint in "canoecraft" to gice 1 or 2 mor inches of space downwarts to get some space for the clamps... just noticed it an the photos. But thats not a big deal I think, what I am wondering about is, how to install the first plank of the Ffreedom 17:

I read in "building Bob`s Special" by Ted Moors that it is a good idea to let the first plank follow the waterline - that means it would be nearly horizontal. Than he advices to fill the rest with short planks to the sheerline at the stem/ bow. On the picture it looks like the there is a slim bow in the first pank - but I´m not sure how big it should be. To be concrete: Should I just fix the first plank on the Mould 8 an fix it horizontal or should I use the sheerline of the neighbour planks to give the plank a little bow - and if: which moulds should I use (7-9 or 6 - 10 for example). Sorry for the many questions - it´s my first canoe to build I´m worry about doing everything right to get a good start.

Thanks for your advice and best regards

Chris
P.S: Here´s a picture of what I made up to now.

[img]http://www.natur-im-sucher.com/canoe/we ... 112004.jpg :lol: :lol: [/img]

[Chris]

Hello,

you ask me to keep you in progress: The planking is working fine up to now, have planked 13 Planks on the starboardside, 11 on the other side - touching the waterline today. I´m using epoxy (West) with 407 filler for gluing, because I wasn`t able to get a brownish carpenters glue. I put the glue on with a 50 ml syringe and wipe away the acces with 855 or 850 solvent. Sure there were a nicer smell if using carpenters glue.

Best regards

Chris

[Glen Smith]

Hi Chris, using epoxy to glue the strips must take a lot of time. I am glad that I can find all kinds of wood glue here in Canada.

[Chris]

Hi Glen,

it takes a lot of time, but especially because of using the stapleless method .After each 3 Planks I have to wait for 10 or twelve hours (next day) to go on. I bought about 40 clamps, so I can work on both sides - so it`s enough work for a day :

I´m going to reach the curve of the bottom now, so maybe it will be necessary to work with less than 3 planks at a time....

Best regards

Chris

[Chris]

I have cut the middle tody. It came out fine. I used a fine dozuki Saw up to a line of about 5mm from the real middle and shape the rest by using a Stanley 220 Hand Plane. Worked fine.


Best regards

Chris

[Chris]

Hello,

after spending two weeks with nice things like a virus infection and a stay in the hospital I started over building my freedom 17 the day before yesterday, I shaped all the hull, it`s starting to look like something. After finishing the shaping my halogen lamp came down, leaving a very nice scratch in the hull - best regards of murphy....

Tomorrow Ißm going to start filling gaps. Do you thing it`s a good idea to make differnet colours of epoxy fillers?

All the best

Chris :eyebrows

[Glen Smith]

I hope you are feeling much better now. :eyebrows

For filling gaps, you might need a variety of colored epoxy batches. A gap that is filled with epoxy that is a bit darker than the adjoining wood will look beter than a gap that has been filled with epoxy that is a lighter color than the wood. You can first wet the wood with lacquer thinner to get a better idea of the final color you should aim for.

Good luck with the patching and watch out for Murphy, he is one tricky fellow.

[Chris]

Hello,

just finished the gap filling today - now I think I have to wait maybe two days until the epoxy is cured so much, that I can easily sand it. Build a fairing board today from plywood. For filling I used a mixture of epoxy with 207 special coating hardener for a longer potlife and colloidal silica filler and sawdust. Have a look at it if yoz are interested in.

Best regards

Chris

www.natur-im-sucher.com/canoe/index.html

[Glen Smith]

Hi Chris, you seem to have done a very good job with the gaps. :eyebrows