First build plans

will · Post by **will** » Mon Jan 12, 2009 11:28 pm

This is my first post and I need some advice. I ordered plans for a Merlin 160 (38 Special) from Northwest Canoe and got only one sheet of prints with all of the station forms overlapping. No indication of how many or where to place thwarts. Nothing about whether or not it is to be used with stems or without.

Is this the norm for the way plans are delivered? I was hoping for a little more info for 55 dollars plus 11 for shipping.

If I end up using these plans (which I think are not designed for stems) and want to use stems like in the Canoecraft book how much do I need to trip step forms? Would it just be the thickness of the inner stem?

How far down the Canoe should the stems stretch?

Should I use these plans or scrap them and buy from another source that is more beginner friendly? Are they all delivered like this? Is Thwart and seat placement all a personal decision? I would think these designs would have specifics on where the weight should be centered when paddling.

Thanks in advance for any feedback!

Post by **Patricks Dad** » Tue Jan 13, 2009 7:49 am

I only have experience with Bear Mountain Boat plans. Those plans have clear outlines for stem molds as well as (overlapped) station molds - drawn in different colors so they are easy to distinquish from one another as they get close together at the center. They also show an overall view of the craft with placement for seats and thwarts. They show details of the stem placement. Inner stem typically goes nearly to the first station mold that abutts the stem molld (rounded over).

mikestenger · Post by **mikestenger** » Tue Jan 13, 2009 11:40 am

I had a wonderful experience with Bear Mountain Plans. I had never built anything anywhere near as complicated as a canoe. The plans for my Bob's Special were clear and well laid out. Using the plans I cut out the forms and they were perfect! The hull turned out very well and I couldn't be more pleased.

canoeblderinmt · Post by **canoeblderinmt** » Tue Jan 13, 2009 3:06 pm

Will,
Buy Gilpatrick's book, Building a Cedar Strip Canoe. His plans come like that, only they are actually IN THE BOOK, so you have to scale them up yourself. His instructions should be helpful in understanding how the forms and stems inter relate.

Greg

dmeenkster · Post by **dmeenkster** » Wed Jan 14, 2009 12:14 am

I have the plans and built the Merlin also, the plans are for use without stems. You would need to remove 3/4 in. to compensate for the thickness of the inner stems if you are planning on building with a stem, and the stems would normally stretch to the first form. The seat should be mounted 6 in. aft of center, the front thwart should be mounted the length of your inseam from the front of the seat, so it can be used as a foot rest, and the rear thwart should be mounted an equal distance from the stern as the front is from the bow. The back of the seat should be 1 in. below the gunwale, and the front of the seat 2 in. lower to allow for paddling from either a kneeling or sitting position. These are the recommondations from Northwest Canoe, but it is your boat, and your personal preferences, and how you plan on using the canoe may suggest different setup.
The Merlin is a great liitle canoe, and handles wonderfully, the plans in Canoecraft or Gilpatricks book do not include specific measurements for the thwarts and seats either, so this is not unusual.
One word of caution, the shouldered tumblehome can make the fiberglassing of the interior of the hull a little challenging. Make sure the fiberglass is stretched in the bilge area or the fiberglass will want to pull away from the hull. I had some air bubbles that required repair after the epoxy set, but no one else seems to notice the repairs but I was very disappointed. If you are not using a single peice of fiberglass this may not be as much of an issue.

Bryan Hansel · Post by **Bryan Hansel** » Wed Jan 14, 2009 9:48 pm

will wrote:Is this the norm for the way plans are delivered?

It is from Northwest. I have a set of plans that arrived in the exact same way. I bought the book also, but can't remember if it told you where to put the seat, thwarts, etc... I've also received plans from other places in the same state. But most also provide a plan or instruction on where to put the outfitting.

How far down the Canoe should the stems stretch?

You should be able to measure this from the plans that you have. The stem station will dictate the distance.

Should I use these plans or scrap them and buy from another source that is more beginner friendly?

The plans for the Freedom Solo are very very detailed and IMHO better for a beginner than those I've received from Northwest.

Is Thwart and seat placement all a personal decision?

A good rule of thumb is the solo's seat should be around 6" back from center. Place the front thwart so you can brace your feet against it. I like the rear thwart to be close to the back of the seat, so that it's easier to pack, but cedar strips are so stiff, you probably don't need a rear thwart. Also, I like to slope the seats a bit forward, so that the front is about 3/4 to 1" lower than the back of the seat.

Glen Smith · Post by **Glen Smith** » Wed Jan 14, 2009 9:54 pm

A good rule of thumb is the solo's seat should be around 6" back from center.

Bryan, in an asymmetrical canoe do you find the center by measuring to midships or by balancing the hull on a piece of pipe or something similar?

Bryan Hansel · Post by **Bryan Hansel** » Thu Jan 22, 2009 11:07 pm

For a center thwart, I balance the canoe and then put the yoke slightly back from center. For the rule of thumb, you just measure to the center.

Jim Dodd · Post by **Jim Dodd** » Sat Jan 24, 2009 3:59 pm

Hi Will

I have a set of 38spl. plans from Bruce Kunz, the designer.
The plans came the same way.
These are "Stemless plans", and in my opinion the best way to build. I don't do the "Sabot" thing.

I've built this boat in several variations, and if you put the seat's front edge at 5 to 6in. aft of center, you'll be fine.

I put the thwart at 27 to 28in. forward of my seat. This seems the handiest, and it will work to wedge your paddle (bent blade), while portaging( Over the thwart, under the seat.)
This may vary with how high you hang your seat, so check before drilling !

The stations, to build the Original 38spl. were spaced at 12.5in.
A friend of mine, by mistake, set his at 12in. I liked it so much, I built one .

I also follow the shearline, with the first strip, no stair stepping.

You will like this hull ! It's easy to build, and a joy to paddle !

Good Luck !

Jim

will · Post by **will** » Sat Jan 24, 2009 6:47 pm

Thank you all for the helpful advice. Glad to hear from someone who has done this same build before! Helps with the confidence. Jim, how did you do the bottom? I see football shapes and seams down the center etc. What worked for you?

Jim Dodd · Post by **Jim Dodd** » Sat Jan 24, 2009 11:19 pm

Hi Will
I strip past center, and cut the center line, the nice thing about this method, you are only fitting half the strips on the bottom, this saves time, and can look cool if you do it right !
I also bead and cove my strips.

Jim

The Bear Mountain Boat Shop

First build plans

First build plans

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