Weight : 1/4" white cedar vs 3/16" pine ?

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Fredz
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Weight : 1/4" white cedar vs 3/16" pine ?

Post by Fredz » Fri Mar 23, 2012 8:04 am

Hello,

After a couple of years reading and a lot of thinking ... since I have no choice but to built outside, I finally decided to go ahead anyway with to Freedom 17. I know that some poeple disaprove building outside (it's not ideal I know), but it's that or nothing !! So I'll keep posting news of the experience :wink

I have begun cutting some pieces for the strongback yesterday. I will assemble the whole thing latter in the season since there is still snow in Quebec city. Since then, I will cut all the pieces I can to be ready.

I have a doubt with the wood to use for planking since to white cedar I have find so far come with a lot a knot (or expensive in comparison of pine). Maybe Glen can help me to find a good supplier since you are in Baie St-Paul "near" Quebec ?

1) I have read some post that recommend 3/16" pine strips if a cannot find good white cedar. Since pine is more heavy, how much weight approx between 1/4" white cedar strips and 3/16" pine strips ? I want to minimize weight for a Freedom 17 ...

2) I've just order a pair of router bit to make bead and cove for 1/4" strips... does the 3/16" pine strips would cause me trouble with this task ?

3) Some suggest 60 board feet of wood for the planking. This translate in how much 1"*6"*8' with the cut waste ? I had calculate around 15 ... but I always buy to much and want to minimize cost

Thank you, looking forward to hear from you !

BearLeeAlive
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Re: Weight : 1/4" white cedar vs 3/16" pine ?

Post by BearLeeAlive » Fri Mar 23, 2012 9:32 am

The specific density of northern white cedar is 28 lb/ft3, and northern pine is 36 lb/ft3. So if you made the pine strips 75% of the thickness of the cedar, their weight would about the same.

I have never done it, but I imagine the the 1/4" bits would work fine. I am sure I have heard of others doing this.
-JIM-

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Glen Smith
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Location: Baie-St-Paul, Quebec, Canada

Re: Weight : 1/4" white cedar vs 3/16" pine ?

Post by Glen Smith » Fri Mar 23, 2012 12:36 pm

Bonjour Frederic, here are two local suppliers:
BMR, 8540 Boul Ste-Anne, Chateau Richer; Western Red Cedar
Specibois, 7680 Boul Ste-Anne, Chateau Richer; Northern White Cedar

At Specibois tell Mr Cauchon it is for a canoe. He usually has 8', 10' and 12' lengths free of knots.

PS: If you can transport long pre-cut strips I have some Western Red Cedar strips you can have. They are in a long cardboard tube.

willo
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Location: Echo Bay ON.

Re: Weight : 1/4" white cedar vs 3/16" pine ?

Post by willo » Fri Mar 23, 2012 4:27 pm

Glen seems to have put you on a good path,I would take him up on the offer of strips. I have been using white pine a lot . My present project is an old style Peterborough out-board that I am bulding with pine. Pine is a little heavier but cutting 3/16 will even it out with little difference in strength.1/4 " bits will work fine on thinner strips.A word of caution is that you want eastern white pine. Lumber stores sell a variety of pine as white pine.Old growth pine has been used to build boats for a long time.What ever you decide enjoy your build, the Freedom 17 is a nice canoe, mine was built with red cedar and white pine accents.

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Patricks Dad
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Location: Warrenville, Illinois

Re: Weight : 1/4" white cedar vs 3/16" pine ?

Post by Patricks Dad » Fri Mar 23, 2012 5:24 pm

willo wrote: My present project is an old style Peterborough out-board that I am bulding with pine.

Willo,
Tell me a bit more about your out-board project. My brother has a 1920's vintage outboard motor and I've been pondering building a rowboat from that era. I'd be interested in more details of your peoject.

thanks
Randy Pfeifer
(847) 341-0618
Randy.Pfeifer1@gmail.com

willo
Posts: 156
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Location: Echo Bay ON.

Re: Weight : 1/4" white cedar vs 3/16" pine ?

Post by willo » Fri Mar 23, 2012 6:11 pm

Hi Randy, I am building a 14 ft Peterborough Zephyr. I bought plans from Steve Killing just over a year ago. Life got in the way so I did not get started until this winter. I have my forms cut and am ready to start ripping strips. Problem is that I am sharing my garage with my 17 year old son who is always rebuilding snow machine and dirt bike engines.If you look on Canadian Canoes website in their image gallery you can find pictures of builds from the same boat. It was Ron Frennete that lead me to Steve Killing, which I thought was rather funny since all the canoe and kayak designs I have built have all been his. I grew up in a very similar boat that my grandfather bought in the fifties so I thought it would be a fun challenge to make one.

Fredz
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Re: Weight : 1/4" white cedar vs 3/16" pine ?

Post by Fredz » Sat Mar 24, 2012 8:33 am

Thank you.
Glen, I just bought my white cedar and WRC from Specibois this morning. Mr Cauchon showed me a photo of your Hiawatha (the same you use on this site I guess). I hope mine will look as good !

Next step : ripping and bead and cove. Any tips ?

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Glen Smith
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Re: Weight : 1/4" white cedar vs 3/16" pine ?

Post by Glen Smith » Sat Mar 24, 2012 11:41 am

Buy this thin kerf 7.25" saw blade (DO724X) for your tablesaw
Image

It works well on a saw that normally uses a 10" blade and it makes a smooth cut and you waste less wood.

Keep your strips in the same order they came off the boards so you can match strips on the left and right sides as you install them.

Get the bead and cove well centered on the strips and cut to the proper depth. Read this info supplied by John Michne: http://www.michneboat.com/Making%20Strips.htm
Wear a respirator mask when working with cedar because the dust is not very good for your lungs.

Did you get the Red cedar from Specibois also?

Fredz
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Re: Weight : 1/4" white cedar vs 3/16" pine ?

Post by Fredz » Sun Mar 25, 2012 9:01 am

Fredz wrote:Did you get the Red cedar from Specibois also?
Yes I also bought the WRC from Specibois. I also paid the extra $ to have it planed down to 7/8", so it's ready to be cut in strips. The wood looks very good ... knot free with beautiful grain. I am very please with it.

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Glen Smith
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Re: Weight : 1/4" white cedar vs 3/16" pine ?

Post by Glen Smith » Sun Mar 25, 2012 12:42 pm

That's something new, he didn't have WRC the last time I was there, only "local" lumber.

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