mitering second half of football Tips

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JesseP
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Joined: Fri Apr 10, 2015 11:13 am
Location: East Central, AB

mitering second half of football Tips

Post by JesseP » Wed Jun 03, 2015 3:25 pm

Hey builders, I have just finished stripping the first half of my football and cut the center line. Everything went OK. I am just about start stripping the second half of the football but before I start I was hoping you guys could share some tips on how to get nice tight miters.

TIA

Jesse
I'm up to my torch.

alick burt
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Re: mitering second half of football Tips

Post by alick burt » Wed Jun 03, 2015 4:52 pm

Hi Jesse
I would say the best tip I could give you for this stage is to take your time.Remember you can always use a strip further in if you cut it too small so don't put them in if they are too short.
I use a 0.5mm propelling pencil for my guide mark when fitting the first end (marking about a foot back) then I transfer it to the other end near to where I will cut the second end.
You will find as Ted says in canoecraft that the strip will need to be cut longer than you might think to fit into the cove but it isn't quite 5/8" but that allows you a bit of margin for getting your angles right.
Never fit the last strip in a hurry, before a tea break, or at the end of the day it is even more important to take your time with this one to get it right.
Good Luck
Alick :wink

JesseP
Posts: 46
Joined: Fri Apr 10, 2015 11:13 am
Location: East Central, AB

Re: mitering second half of football Tips

Post by JesseP » Wed Jun 03, 2015 5:48 pm

Thanks Alick.
I have done a few trial cuts and was not pleased with the results. I am still working over the stem where there are compound curves and it is proving very difficult. Another question I have is about outer stem length. Would i guy be able to extent the outer stem a inch or so past the 6th station to cover any ugly miters in the compound section?

Thanks
I'm up to my torch.

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Grumple
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Re: mitering second half of football Tips

Post by Grumple » Thu Jun 04, 2015 2:45 pm

Hi Jesse,

I'm going through this exact process, and having the exact same difficulties. I've found that using a ton of patience, and following the instructions from a few experienced forum members has been very helpful.

Here is the process I'm following, as described by 'Patricks Dad' on my build thread. Others chime in with very helpful bonus info.
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=4504#p28560

It's generally working well if I'm patient, but here are a few key lessons I've learned, along with a mistake that I'll now have to hide in the finish phase. I'm hoping the next strips will go better, but maybe I can save you some heartache:
  • When I dry fit for pencil bench mark lines, etc, I take the time to clamp my strips down with my L-brackets. Others can just use straps, tape, but for me the clamps are what seems to work for now. On my first attempt I was just physically holding them down myself while trying to mark, and it was a disaster.
  • I damaged my coves quite a bit taking the strip on/off for test fits, etc. I will be much more careful of this going forward. I don't know if there is any major trick, other than not to hurry, and now when I remove after a dry fit I carefully remove from one end to the other instead of letting the center of the strip pop up/out while the ends are still pinned. It seems to help.
  • Related to the above, whenever I am fitting one end, I keep a spring clamp attached to a mold towards the other end of the canoe, just above my most recently glued strip. I let the strip I'm fiddling with lay on the top side of the spring clamp to keep it from beating up the cove of the strip below.
  • On my first go at this, I made a key mistake when I placed the benchmark pencil line for alignment of the second end being shaped. I had only pulled the strip into place on every few molds thinking I was reducing the chance of cove damage, and made my mark. I shaped the end to fit perfectly with these pencil benchmarks aligned. HOWEVER, when I glued the strip fully in place, that tiny bit of extra 'pull-down' that occured by pinning the strip at each mold, caused a small gap at the end of the strip due to length lost pulling it down everywhere. In hindsight my mistake was obvious, but I guess that's part of learning.

Stephen
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Re: mitering second half of football Tips

Post by Stephen » Thu Jun 04, 2015 8:10 pm

Would i guy be able to extent the outer stem a inch or so past the 6th station to cover any ugly miters in the compound section?
I assume your inner stem ends right at station 6. If so, extending the outer stem past station 6 may lead to unpleasant surprises. When you excavate the outer stem mortice it would be easy to chisel a hole right through the hull at that spot. If you check pg 134 of Canoecraft, Ted tells you to cut the outer stem an inch shorter to avoid this problem.

This post has some good pictures of the stem mortice. http://bearleealive.smugmug.com/Other/C ... 415-XL.jpg
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=4276

JesseP
Posts: 46
Joined: Fri Apr 10, 2015 11:13 am
Location: East Central, AB

Re: mitering second half of football Tips

Post by JesseP » Sat Jun 06, 2015 11:31 am

Ya, I read that in canoecraft as well. I was just wondering if anyone has done it before with successful results. Its not that the miters are horrible or anything, just if i could cover them it would be better. I think i will just flush the outer stem with the inner stem and call it a project. There is only one gap at a miter that is bothering me, other than that, i am satisfied.

Thanks for the help.

Jesse P
I'm up to my torch.

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Denis
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Re: mitering second half of football Tips

Post by Denis » Sun Jun 07, 2015 6:38 pm

Your mitres over the inner stem are only critcal when you reach the last inch of the inner stem. The outer stem needs to to be cut shorter than the inner stem as mentioned earlier to prevent a hole in the bottom of the boat. The rest of the area to the bow and stern will be mitred out anyway so don't spend a lot of time trying to make a perfect fit. In case you missed it the outer stem is rabbeted down to the inner stem. Unfortunately I dont seem to have a picture of the rabbeting you will end up doing but I am sure there is one somewhere in the forum. If your strips have been installed perfectly level on each side you will have an easier time matching the joins from one side to the other. If you are out of alignment a bit it will be more difficult to make a perfect match. (place a level accross your installed strips and see if it matches the level of the strongback) Be sure not to force the strips into place as that may cause some misalignment as well as actually pushing up your centre line area. (been there did it lol)

As mentioned ealier by another take your time doing the fill in and if your tired or out of sorts with the process take a break and go at it later.

Good luck with it. perhaps someone lives close to you and has already gotten through the process and would be willing to drop by and offer a bit of help :thinking

Denis

ps I just checked the links shown above and the second one is more likely what you will be striving for with the inner stem showing and a L shape cut into the planking I am reposting the link for you here
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=4276

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