19' 9" Chaa Creek Expedition

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jimlgordon
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Location: Bainbridge Island, Washington

Re: 19' 9" Chaa Creek Expedition

Post by jimlgordon »

I had a few staples break off and I was not able to grab them with pliers to remove them. Any ideas about what to do?
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jimlgordon
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Re: 19' 9" Chaa Creek Expedition

Post by jimlgordon »

Spreader or roller for spreading epoxy when it's time to glass? I had a teacher recommend spreader and that is how we did the kayak.
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Jim Dodd
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Re: 19' 9" Chaa Creek Expedition

Post by Jim Dodd »

I have staples break also. Usually while pulling them. I don't worry about them, unless they tear up my sand paper, on ROS. Then a good Needle nose pliers comes in for surgery !

I really love a 6" Cigar foam rollers !! Many use a Squeege. I don't like how they distore the cloth, and leave verticle lines in the resin!
I loose very little resin on the floor with the foam roller. Draw back to a roller, is they soak up a little resin.

Here's a pic of my son applying a seal coat to his first canoe. He's using a 4" roller here. There are different Grades of foam. Be sure to get the ones suitable for Varnish !

Image

Image
Keep your paddle wet and your seat dry!
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Cruiser
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Re: 19' 9" Chaa Creek Expedition

Post by Cruiser »

Roller here as well, but I use a larger 7" one


Brian
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jimlgordon
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Re: 19' 9" Chaa Creek Expedition

Post by jimlgordon »

Is it best to pour on the hull after mixing in a cup then roll it out or to use a tray like for painting?
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Cruiser
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Re: 19' 9" Chaa Creek Expedition

Post by Cruiser »

I think either way is fine, I pour because it is simpler .... just beware that you likely don't want to make a puddle, sometimes that leaves an area of wood darker (more epoxy absorbed), so keep the application to a smaller stream like quantity.

The other thing I learned is keep the application moving, don't leave an even wet edge and never leave a wet edge longer than you have to. Having a second hand on the other side is optimum ... I can usually get most of a side done before it is time to sqeegee ... that really simplifies the job.


Brian
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jimlgordon
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Re: 19' 9" Chaa Creek Expedition

Post by jimlgordon »

What is the best way to fill cracks in the hull? On a kayak, we used wood dust and epoxy. Can I use non-epoxy wood filler, like for furniture, since it's going to be encased in epoxy anyway?
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Cruiser
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Re: 19' 9" Chaa Creek Expedition

Post by Cruiser »

I have taken to filling the cracks just before I am doing the glassing ... make up a thickened epoxy (coloured as you like) and work it into the cracks, wipe off ... put glass down and proceed.

This saves a lot of bother and sanding.

You can use a different filler if it dries completely ... just too much bother to figure out if it is compatible IMO

Brian
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Jim Dodd
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Re: 19' 9" Chaa Creek Expedition

Post by Jim Dodd »

Fine saw dust and Titebond, or what ever glue you have. Mix and rub in. Dries in minutes.
Me ? I shy away from Yellow glue. Lately I'm in love with Elmer's Max.

Jim
Keep your paddle wet and your seat dry!
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jimlgordon
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Re: 19' 9" Chaa Creek Expedition

Post by jimlgordon »

The Chaa Creek Expedition is a really big boat. Should I add an extra layer of glass on the bottom of the hull? I am worried about it being stiff enough, especially when people step in and out.
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Jim Dodd
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Re: 19' 9" Chaa Creek Expedition

Post by Jim Dodd »

I do to ALL my strippers !!!
I cut the extra layer, to cover up to the 3" waterline. You can do more or less, that's just what I do.

The only draw back is when portaging. The extra layer adds soo much durability to a hull, it's a No Brainer in my book !

I often retell the story of a very good friend, while on a Wilderness trip, needed Duct Tape to get out of the BWCA !
He Bragged about how Light his canoe was ! The crack in the keel line ended that !

If you want to prove this to yourself, Mix a very small batch of resin, and wet out a single layer of cloth, then wet out a double layer of cloth. Lay both on some plastic. Wait a few days, and peel them off the plastic. With just your hands, test them for strength.

It's your canoe ! Me ? I'd double layer !

Jim
Keep your paddle wet and your seat dry!
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Cruiser
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Re: 19' 9" Chaa Creek Expedition

Post by Cruiser »

That Cha Creek is a beast in size, so weight is going to be a big consideration IMO.

Examine how you intend to use the boat
- are you going to portage it?
- type of water
- expected loads

In other words, how far do you expect to push this canoe ... if you are just paddling around a cottage lake and are worried about people stepping in and out ... that is not a concern, the 6 oz glass is more than adequate IMO.

If you are going to trip it and that will involve portaging, then you need to start looking at weight from here on in .... rather than an extra 6 oz on the football, maybe 4 oz if you decide you are pushing the boat some. Other ideas to save weight going forward, smaller lighter decks, smaller gunnels, lighter thwarts.

The trim can add up to a 1/3 (sometimes more) of the canoe weight ... remember that a canoe is a compromise of parameters, based on your intended usage. An extra strong canoe that weighs 100+ pounds at the portage is nobodys friend.

I have a Freedom 17, which while not 19' 9" it doesn't have an extra layer ... for my purposes of wilderness camping, mostly lake travel and portaging ... base strength is more than adequate and I don't need the weight at the portage, it handles 2 Largish paddlers and gear for a week with no issues.


Brian
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jimlgordon
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Re: 19' 9" Chaa Creek Expedition

Post by jimlgordon »

Most of our paddling is in the ocean and some rivers and lakes. The ocean (Puget Sound) is just down the street from our home. No portaging, but lots of loading and unloading from the car and hauling it down to the water's edge. My father and I used to spend a week in BWCA every summer (that was in the 70's). I am pretty well done with whitewater canoeing... I will leave that for others.
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Jim Dodd
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Re: 19' 9" Chaa Creek Expedition

Post by Jim Dodd »

Maybe you could get Ted to share his thoughts, after all, it's his design !

Going with a 4 oz layer, and reducing the the size of an extra layer, may be worth considering.
A Tip, or How I do it.
Wet out the main layer, once it has set, so it is no longer tacky, lay on the extra layer. Wet it out, and fill the weave on the vertical of the hull, the same time.

Some like to wet out both layers at one time, by laying the main layer Over the extra layer. This may save resin.
I, myself prefer extra layer on Top. here's a pic of my reasoning.

Image

Still another option ! Add extra cloth strips, running from gunnel to gunnel on the inside. It won't provide abrasion resistance to the outside, but it would help hold the hull together in choppy seas.

Jim
Keep your paddle wet and your seat dry!
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jimlgordon
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Location: Bainbridge Island, Washington

Re: 19' 9" Chaa Creek Expedition

Post by jimlgordon »

strips on the inside from gunnel to gunnel is an interesting idea... kind of like invisible ribs
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