Good-day to all. I will be laying up my first Bob's Special (See photos here) in about a week using East System epoxy with the slow hardener and 6 oz cloth. I'm fortunate to have three guys to help for the day, and want to get all three coats done in one shot (as per CanoeCraft's recommendation). This is the most intimidating part that I have experienced thus far in the canoe building process. So, I'm asking if anyone has any final words of advice for me (a total newbie). As I say, I am using CanoeCraft, so I plan on staying close to their procedure, although I'm very open to other suggestions and ideas. Thanks in advance.
Adam
Lay up in a few days (with some trepidation)
Lay up in a few days (with some trepidation)
Last edited by Adamv on Fri Jan 11, 2008 12:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Who travels not by water knows not the fear of God --- 17th Century Sailor
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Bryan Hansel
- Posts: 678
- Joined: Fri May 14, 2004 6:36 pm
- Location: Grand Marais, MN
- Contact:
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Glen Smith
- Posts: 3719
- Joined: Sat May 08, 2004 9:08 am
- Location: Baie-St-Paul, Quebec, Canada
As Bryan stated, follow the procedures and take your time. After applying a coat, check back on it often to catch any bubbles, runs or lifting cloth. Make sure the person dispensing the epoxy knows about the proper mix ratio and if using calibrated pumps, it's one shot resin, one shot hardener, one shot resin, one shot hardener, etc..... Mix thoroughly but not too vigorously or you will be injecting a lot of air into the mixture.
I always recommend making a test on some glued-up scrap strips or a piece of plywood to get the feel for the procedure before attacking the first job.
I always recommend making a test on some glued-up scrap strips or a piece of plywood to get the feel for the procedure before attacking the first job.
Layup
Adam, go here and read Ted's paper on fiberglassing. Expecially see how Ted holds the squeegee!
http://www.westsystem.com/ewmag/16/fiberglassing.html
Ed...
http://www.westsystem.com/ewmag/16/fiberglassing.html
Ed...
Ed Alger
I think CanoeCraft highlights the use of a brush for applying the epoxy. Personally I recommend learning with a short nap foam roller. IMO, if you're starting from scratch the roller is a better tool to learn to use because:
it's faster to spread epoxy
cleaning brushes is a pain
once a brush is ruined it costs a lot more to replace
it's faster to spread epoxy
cleaning brushes is a pain
once a brush is ruined it costs a lot more to replace
Adam,
Even though East says their epoxy can be used at 10C, it will probably blush... I wouldn't take a chance using it on a stripper at those low temps, since there probably will not be a good bond forming between blushed layers of epoxy after the first wetout.
You'll most likely get good results if you use it at higher temps, I heated my basement up to 23C and it worked out fine, with no blushing visible and working time long enough to apply and squeegee properly.
Another poster here (Erich) has heated the workspace up to 30C and had good results, but the working time could be less than if the epoxy is kept cooler.
East epoxy will blush at low temps and high humidity, so I also keep a dehumidifier running to dry out the air, just in case, and wash the epoxy with water and a clean rag after it's had time to cure.
Working at 23C and with the dehumidifier going, I haven't seen the blushing that occurs at low temps, but there could be some, so washing off is just a measure to ensure that there won't be any to weaken the bond when applying another layer of glass or when varnishing.
To get the strong chemical bond between layers of epoxy, the second and third layers should be applied when the previous coat is still tacky... don't use the number of hours stated in Canoecraft described for West epoxy... for East, use a finger or a cotton ball and see if the surface is still sticky... if it's cured much past that, the chemical bond between coats will probably not be too strong. Better to apply the coats a little earlier than too late.
You might want to try glassing a test panel at the temps and humidity that you'll be working at, if there are any doubts about how the epoxy will perform... good luck!
East epoxy might behave differently than West which was what was used during the descriptions in Canoecraft... just some thoughts on using it.Good-day to all. I will be laying up my first Bob's Special (See photos here) in about a week using East System epoxy with the slow hardener
Even though East says their epoxy can be used at 10C, it will probably blush... I wouldn't take a chance using it on a stripper at those low temps, since there probably will not be a good bond forming between blushed layers of epoxy after the first wetout.
You'll most likely get good results if you use it at higher temps, I heated my basement up to 23C and it worked out fine, with no blushing visible and working time long enough to apply and squeegee properly.
Another poster here (Erich) has heated the workspace up to 30C and had good results, but the working time could be less than if the epoxy is kept cooler.
East epoxy will blush at low temps and high humidity, so I also keep a dehumidifier running to dry out the air, just in case, and wash the epoxy with water and a clean rag after it's had time to cure.
Working at 23C and with the dehumidifier going, I haven't seen the blushing that occurs at low temps, but there could be some, so washing off is just a measure to ensure that there won't be any to weaken the bond when applying another layer of glass or when varnishing.
To get the strong chemical bond between layers of epoxy, the second and third layers should be applied when the previous coat is still tacky... don't use the number of hours stated in Canoecraft described for West epoxy... for East, use a finger or a cotton ball and see if the surface is still sticky... if it's cured much past that, the chemical bond between coats will probably not be too strong. Better to apply the coats a little earlier than too late.
You might want to try glassing a test panel at the temps and humidity that you'll be working at, if there are any doubts about how the epoxy will perform... good luck!
Last edited by Rick on Thu Dec 07, 2006 5:10 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Rod Tait
The more you read the better. There are obviously different methods and all work fine as long as you stick with it. I prefer rollers, especialy on a big boat since they will give you a much more even coat and take much less time. Having a few friends will certainly make things go smoother, but I caution against everyone getting too involved.
I once helped a customer glass his kayak in his garage. He had a few friends along to help and they wanted to see how it was done. Before I knew it, eveyone was mixing epoxy, pouring it on the boat and things got out of hand. I had to take control and ask a few people to just watch.
Along with others, I have some info on my web site.
Link below.
I once helped a customer glass his kayak in his garage. He had a few friends along to help and they wanted to see how it was done. Before I knew it, eveyone was mixing epoxy, pouring it on the boat and things got out of hand. I had to take control and ask a few people to just watch.
Along with others, I have some info on my web site.
Link below.
Just make sure everyone has a job and they do only that job. I like to have a friend do mixing and quality control (looking for runs and inadequate wetout). They get to keep their gloves cleaner and help with the bow and stern glass. don't be afraid of getting after it pretty quickly with the scraper. I start from the middle and work each way (alternating). A little faster one way than the other so I can get a fresh epoxy line at the "last to epoxy" end in the middle of epoxying the first end. If you don't want epoxy on the floor, put down some plastic or old rugs.
Just remember that it will go better on the next boat. Just kidding - I know you willl do fine. First glassing is is an anxious time for everyone. I'm impressed you went right to a stripper with your first build. I did not hare the guts.
Just remember that it will go better on the next boat. Just kidding - I know you willl do fine. First glassing is is an anxious time for everyone. I'm impressed you went right to a stripper with your first build. I did not hare the guts.