Stem wood type

[pumpkin]

I need to make inner and outer stems. Looking around my shop, I see that I have;
Douglas fir
Red oak
Red wood
Pine
Spruce
Poplar
Cheap mahogany
Not cheap mahogany
Swamp oak
Maple

So, if you had a choice of these, which would you use for inner and which for outer stems.

I have read that oak can cause resin problems so that’s out. I would love to use cherry or walnut but a 1X2 of either is about the same as my mortgage payment.

Thanks Glen, for helping me to get here.

Matthew

[Patricks Dad]

I would use the lightest thing I have that bends nicely for the inner stem. For the outer stem, I would use Cherry (or Walnut) if that's what you want. You'll have the canoe much longer than you will have a mortgage to worry about. Build it the way you want it. Don't spend the rest of your life looking at the canoe saying, "I wish I had used (cherry or walnut) but instead I used this (whatever) because it was cheaper...."

[David James]

I'm currently building with Redwood. I'm using Redwood for the inner strems and Maple for the outers. The Maple bent easily for me and contrasts nicely with the Redwood.

Randy makes a valid point though.

Dave

[pumpkin]

I would like to use cherry but I think that it will blend into the redwood and lose its appeal. I love cherry but to spend that kind of cash on a chunk of wood, I really prefer to have it stand out and say “look at me.”

Walnut is dark just like the redwood, same issue.

I will use the redwood for inner stems. Thank you both. I was considering using maple for outer stems but with redwood strips I am worried that it will contrast too much. I haven’t even given thought to detail work like seat frames etc to help the contrast not seem so harsh. Without something else to help draw the eye away from the stems, I think maple will stand out like a coal miners teeth, white against dark. Is it noticeable to you Dave? Or am I just overthinking this?

I am just setting up my forms so I have a week or 2 to get it together.

Matthew

[David James]

Matthew, I was actually looking for the "coal miner's teeth" effect. I have an accent strip of Redwood and Basswood, and wanted the stems to match the lighter colored Basswood. Hey, maybe I'm goofy - on my first canoe I alternated 1/8" strips of Cherry and Birch for my stems. :razz
For my current boat though, it'll be inwales, outwales and seat frame all of Maple.

Dave

[pumpkin]

Well Dave, now you have me thinking. If I use the good mahogany and maple for trim, it could be really sharp. I have several hundred feet of the mahogany so I could make maple/mahogany inwalls, outwall, seats, thwarts, decks, etc. I'll have to have a look.

Matthew

[Arctic]

Oak stems will work if you apply a coat of "Teak Oak" Epoxy.
This is an epoxy made specifically for oak and will seal thinks up so that glassing with other epoxy (I use West System) will set up nicely.

I am using Oak for both my inner and outer stems on the Prospector I am building.

Mark

[Adamv]

I used WRC for the hull, a kind of philipine mahogany for the wales, and black walnut for the stems. You can see the contrast here:

http://www.avoisin.com/album/canoe/slid ... 20343.html

The walnut was easy to work, and I'm happy with the look.

Cheers,
Adam

[pumpkin]

I will check into the epoxy, Mark. Do you have to wipe oak with acetone or lacquer thinner before applying the epoxy?

Adam, I like your canoe. It looks great with the flat finish. Or is that an illusion? How did you achieve it? With flat over gloss? I have been wondering about applying a marine paste rubbing varnish. I use rubbing varnish on furniture I build and love the hand rubbed satin finish. I hate varnish glare.

Matthew

[Redleg]

Matthew,

For what it's worth, I've built 2 canoes, one with walnut stems and one with ash, I think the darker woods look better for the stems. To me it outlines the profile of the boat better.

Using what you have, I'd go for the mahogany. I think most mahoganies bleach out over time w/sun exposure so you might consider that. As you know cherry will darken.

One way to save a little $$ - some lumber dealers stock #1 or #2 common lumber. It will have knots of course so not good for long strips but for short lengths needed for stems, decks, seat frames etc you can usually work around the knots.

Consider scrounging too - a local millworks or cabinet shop might let you dig through the scrap pile for offcuts. A bundle of skinny leftovers from rips - wouldn't need much.

Barring that I'd spring for the wood you really want. You'll forget the extra $ in a couple months but you you'll be looking at the canoe for the rest of your life.

Steve

[pumpkin]

Thanks for the replies. I wasn’t sure how to proceed. Adams canoe convinced me. It has a simple beauty that I like.

Today I went scrounging, looking for other peoples scrap. A buddy gave me a 4 foot long piece of an old 2” thick shuffleboard top. Neither of us are sure of the species but it has a birch or rock maple look. It’s about 60 or 80 pounds but has some possibilities for paddle blades.

Then I stopped at a mom and pop lumberyard for some glue. I asked about hardwood and was told they only have oak. I asked to see and was directed into an out building where I found a half a dozen bins of cherry, walnut, ash, etc. I asked how much for their imaginary cherry and ash and had to drag the guy out to prove it existed. I picked out 10 board feet of 1X4 and 1X6 cherry planed to true 1” thickness for 40 dollars. They are only 3 to 4 feet long but I think I can make them work for seats, stems, yoke, etc. :big grin

Their ash is in decent lengths also, true 1". Gunwales, paddles? :twisted evil

Problem solved. Matthew

[Adamv]

Matthew,

On the inside of the hull, I used, based on a suggestion from Glen, a varnish with a matte finish (Epiphanes). My main reason was that I really butchered the epoxy on the inside. I did a poor job with it, and wasn't really able to get it perfect no matter how much sanding I did. The matte finish hides some of the blemishes nicely. I also really like that it doesn't produce a glare on a sunny day, and I'm inclinded to think that it's a bit less slippery. It is a bit expensive though. However, I will definitely be using it again on my next build.

Cheers,
Adam

[Rick]

Just a note on glueing oak... I've used epoxy to glue both white oak and red oak and both bonded strongly. This was before I heard that epoxy would not.

Using what you have, I'd go for the mahogany. I think most mahoganies bleach out over time w/sun exposure so you might consider that. As you know cherry will darken.

What will black walnut do? I bought some boards and might use them in a canoe.

Thanks!

[pumpkin]

Hijack warning!

Adam, lokks like you are a pretty good butcher. Like I said, I have been using a paste varnish on my furniture. I came across this recently
http://www.jamestowndistributors.com/us ... 12362&BASE

It is the same brand name as the stuff I use. The furniture varnish applies easy and although the price of this is a bit high, a quart goes a long long way. There is no waste from drips or a half a pint lost in the bristles of a brush.

Someone here reminded me that this is a long term investment and cost should be no object. I think I may try it.

Has anyone used the marine rubbing varnish?

Matthew

[Patricks Dad]

This looks pretty interesting (i'm miserable with a brush). It's quite a bit cheaper than Eppifanes (If I remember right). Has anyone here used it?