Brass Stem Band Question

[wb9tpg]

Question on the brass stem bands. I assume they get epoxied into place before varnishing. Do I varnish over them or not?

I wish I'd not made the decision to use them but the stems are prepped for them now and I'm committed.

[Glen Smith]

The brass bands should be held in place with screws. Applying varnish is futile since the brass bands will take hits and the varnish will chip off.
Why do you say it is too late to not use the brass bands?

[wb9tpg]

I already shaped the stems with a flat 3/8" area to accept them.

I thought the stem bands were placed over thickened epoxy. The ones I bought from beam mountain have a concave back

[Glen Smith]

You could lightly round over the edges and go without brass bands. The cove back is actually for applying a bedding compound but screws are still needed to hold the bands in place. Some builders have installed them with epoxy but at least one reported that one of his bands came off when he hit an obstacle. You will have to roughen the cove area with some 40 grit paper for a good adhesion.

[backpaddler]

Hi,
I did just as Glen has suggested and rounded over the outer stems. I wrapped two strips of 4oz. cloth, cut on the bias, around the stems for added protection. the stips were 3" wide and 6" wide starting from about 8" behind where the stem fairs into the keel line to the sheerline end of the stem.
This worked great and no brass stems.

Hope this might help
Bruce

[wb9tpg]

You could lightly round over the edges and go without brass bands. The cove back is actually for applying a bedding compound but screws are still needed to hold the bands in place. Some builders have installed them with epoxy but at least one reported that one of his bands came off when he hit an obstacle. You will have to roughen the cove area with some 40 grit paper for a good adhesion.

Glen, the bedding compound you mention; is it thickened epoxy or something else?

I do have the brass screws but will drive steel screws first then remove them.

[Mihun09]

A short time ago I installed the stem bands on the wood canvas canoe I refurbished. Sounds like they are pretty much the same as you have, 3/8" width, concave back. likely 4 foot length...

I asked on the WCHA forums for advice on how to install them and if interested the thread for that is here... http://forums.wcha.org/showthread.php?9 ... le-spacing

I used a 3M brand sealent for bedding compound. I pre-drilled a couple of holes 6" apart on the flat part of the hull, drilled pilot holes in the stem and put in steel screws of the same size, #4's. Then carefully bent the band around the stem and over the deck as much as possible. I removed the bands, marked the hole locations and drilled/countersunk the holes off the boat, then reinstalled with brass screws and slowly pilot drilled the new holes, ran a steel screw in first to set the threads before putting in a brass screw. I did break one under the canvas and managed to get a steel screw in beside the broken brass one. I know it will rust but I cannot remove the broken screw without removing the canvas so it will have to wait.

It is tedious work at it's best.

Good luck
Karin

[wb9tpg]

A short time ago I installed the stem bands on the wood canvas canoe I refurbished. Sounds like they are pretty much the same as you have, 3/8" width, concave back. likely 4 foot length...

I asked on the WCHA forums for advice on how to install them and if interested the thread for that is here... http://forums.wcha.org/showthread.php?9 ... le-spacing

I used a 3M brand sealent for bedding compound. I pre-drilled a couple of holes 6" apart on the flat part of the hull, drilled pilot holes in the stem and put in steel screws of the same size, #4's. Then carefully bent the band around the stem and over the deck as much as possible. I removed the bands, marked the hole locations and drilled/countersunk the holes off the boat, then reinstalled with brass screws and slowly pilot drilled the new holes, ran a steel screw in first to set the threads before putting in a brass screw. I did break one under the canvas and managed to get a steel screw in beside the broken brass one. I know it will rust but I cannot remove the broken screw without removing the canvas so it will have to wait.

It is tedious work at it's best.

Good luck
Karin

How did you seal the stem to protect it from water damage?

[Mihun09]

On a wood canvas boat the canvas covers the stems, it is only the stem band screw holes that can allow water to the stem itself. The 3M 4200 Marine Adhesive Sealant was applied to the holes prior to setting the brass screws. It should stop any water from getting to the wood. You might have better luck getting bedding compound than I did, my local marine supply store recommended the 3M stuff I used.

On the stripper I built last year, I just bull nosed the stems and applied 3 layers of cloth on the biaxial to create "skid plates" that pretty much blended with the boat.

I have another wood/canvas project coming up and if I could do away with the brass stem bands I would.

[wb9tpg]

OK, I'm throwing out the brass stem bands and will round over the stems lightly as Glen suggested. It's more work but I feel very comfortable with that decision.

Can you guys please walk me through the fiberglassing procedure for the stems? I know I need to bias cut the fiberglass and I have enough 4oz cloth to do it. I'm confused on how many coats of epoxy on the first cloth layer before the 2nd fiberglass layer? Do I let the first dry before the 2nd or do I do it while I can still get a chemical bond? I'm a little lost if I even need 2 layers or not. I expect this to get lake use and never see rough water (maybe a rough wife).

Your guidance is much appreciated!

[Mihun09]

Oh, don't throw them out, ship them to me!

I just started another wood canvas project, a 14' Chestnut and may replace the original alum stem bands with brass.

I think I put 3 layers of glass on for a skid plate since this boat is going to contact rocks at some points in it's life. Lay out the glass flat and cut strips on an angle long enough to cover the stems.
If you don't foresee any rock contact then one layer may be sufficient. I started with a smaller piece and layered on larger(wider) pieces and put them all down in one session. Any wrinkles that form can usually be brushed out or snip it and lay it flat overlapping the edges. I put the skid plates on before the additional coats of epoxy on the entire hull and for the most part was able to sand down the cloth edges to disappear.



I think in this pic if you look closely you can just see the edge of the extra glass on the stem, but there are 3 layers on there.

[wb9tpg]

Well I put two layers of fiberglass on the stems today. It'll look pretty good once I get it sanded out.

I'm very happy with the results. Thanks to all for your help!