Need Advice

dadd-o-4 · Post by **dadd-o-4** » Tue Sep 18, 2007 12:29 pm

I have inherited a project canoe. The story behind it is that the builder had passed away during construction and it has sat in his basement for the last 3 years. The boat had been completely stripped sthe stems added and some initial fairing done. During the last 3 years the cedar has dried out to the point where some of the glue joints have seperated. These have been repaired using epoxy and cedar dust as well as the final fairing of the stems.

I am having a problem however in getting the hull faired properly. There is a waviness to it which is quite visible as one looks down the hull. The hull was constructed with 3/16 strips for weight saving and the hull seems a little too flexible (ie too much sanding has been done to date) to go any further in taking the waviness out of the cedar itself. To date I have used a flexible fairing board, random orbital sander and a vibratory finish sander, none of which seem to make much difference. Since I dare not go any further with the cedar I am looking at alternatives. One of the alternatives under consideration would be to build up the outside with epoxy to get the fair surface and then apply the glass to this. The other would be to apply a seal coat (a no-brainer in this case due to the dryness of the cedar) apply the fibrglass and epoxy and fair the hull with application of epoxy outside of the glass. Which method would be preferred as there are pros and cons to each. To begin with there is a small risk that the glass will float over the dips of the unfair hull causing problems. also fairing after the glass is applied would pose the risk of exposing the glass itself during the process. On the other hand there would probably be a strucural trade off if the glass is applied to a hull with an epoxy thickness of around 1 mm in spots (ie glass floating in excess epoxy) if the hull were built up and faired first. I have basically given up that the hull will not appear blotchy, the only redeeming fact is that the cedar is dark so it won't show as much (I hope).

Rehd Brown · Post by **Rehd Brown** » Tue Sep 18, 2007 2:29 pm

Well, if we're taking votes... I'd cast mine for glassing the hull as is, then when you get fill coats on, ( weave is covered ) go over it with fairing boards. This will expose the low areas and then you could add epoxy to those areas.

That being said, I don't know how deep of ripples you are talking about. But, before I use a half gallon of epoxy to try and fill... I'd just accept the fact that's it's going to be uneven... Use the boat as a beater/loaner/trainer.

Sounds like, possibly, the original builder wasn't too carefull in visually fairing the strips as he applied them.. But, hey, it's a boat and I'm sure VERY servicable.. :)

Rehd

Glen Smith · Post by **Glen Smith** » Tue Sep 18, 2007 2:43 pm

My vote is with Rehd's advice.

When sanding or fairing the outer hull, many of us use too fine a grit and end up applying too much pressure which could have caused what you are seeing. Starting with a rough grit (about 60) and using a light touch will produce a fair surface that only require a light sanding with a R.O.S. before glassing. It is also important to have the hull on the forms when sanding the exterior in order to support the strips.

BTW: do you have any idea what canoe model it is?

Bryan Hansel · Post by **Bryan Hansel** » Tue Sep 18, 2007 8:14 pm

Glass it, fair the surface using micro-balloons, and paint the outside. Then make the inside nice. A white hull always looks great with a bright inside finish. The micro-balloons are easy to sand, add little weight, and are used for this type of fairing all the time.

Check out the paint job/finish on Charles Campbell's canoe at this link: Wigeon

dadd-o-4 · Post by **dadd-o-4** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 1:24 pm

The boat is a war canoe. The lines were taken from one built by Peel Marine in the early 70's. It is for a local canoe club and they have a fair amount invested in it already when they commissioned the original builder to do it 3 years ago. fact is the widow is moving and needs to have it out of her basement so I will go along with the majority to glass it and then look at building it up to get a fair surface. If this is not possible to obtain then the club will have to make the decision to use a fairing compound and then paint the exterior as that definitely seems like at this time the most efficient solution. Glassing will be scheduled for Sunday.
Last night I think I found the fairing problem. I measured the strip thickness at the shear and it was down around 1/8 of an inch in spots. At one end of the strongback were 2 belt sanders, so putting 2 and 1/8 together the answer becomes obvious.

Bryan Hansel · Post by **Bryan Hansel** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 8:51 pm

If it's a war canoe, then a fake birch bark paint job on the outside would seem perfect.

Check this out: http://www.redrivercanoe.ca/faux%20birchbark.htm

Robbie · Post by **Robbie** » Thu Sep 20, 2007 7:20 pm

Now that's creativity. Wonderful work!
Cheers, Robbie.