need hardwood and some advice hope somone can help.

Bob Ott · Post by **Bob Ott** » Thu Sep 16, 2004 6:14 pm

Hi all I just had a quick couple questions. This forum has been amazing thoughout my project I thought I'd try it one more time.

I am building the Freedom 17 and am ready to install the inwales and outwales but I am having a real tuff time finding what I want in Kenora ontario. I was hoping to get mahogany or oak but noone seems to have anything in 18' lenghts. Does anyone know of anyplace that has this length of wood? All I can find are 16' here.

If that fails I have heard that a 7 to 1 scarf joint to put 2 pieces together to make 18 is the best way. Anyone have any comments?

Thanks again and keep up the building guys.

Michael_3 · Post by **Michael_3** » Thu Sep 16, 2004 7:34 pm

18' lengths of Mahogany IS hard to get hold of...if I were in your shoes I'd try three things...

I'm sure you could get them through Great Northern Craft. You could email Ian MaCrath @ gncbc@aol.com. If we knew one another better...I'd have said that it could be stuck in with my order and then the shipping would have been free. Unfortunately my order left a few days ago. However, you could ask Ian if he is sending something else out this way and see if you can't piggy back your few pieces in the bundle.

There is a pretty good supplier in Peterborough...Monoghan Lumber Specialities
(705) 742-9593

OR...you could phone Lee Valley Tools. No they don't sell wood...but a more experienced salesperson would know some good leads that might be closer to home.

Hope you post a pic when you are done :-)

Michael

Glen Smith · Post by **Glen Smith** » Thu Sep 16, 2004 10:29 pm

Noah's Marine in Toronto sell gunwale stock and scuppered inwales: http://noahsmarine.com/Canada/Strip_Can ... g-can.html.

Scarfing with an angle of 7 or 8 to 1 works fine also. I show my scarf jig on my photo site: http://groups.msn.com/CanoesKayaks/scarfjig.msnw.

Juneaudave · Post by **Juneaudave** » Thu Sep 16, 2004 10:45 pm

I'm going to go ahead and scarf my ash gunnels on the Rice Lake. I could get Sitka Spruce or other woods in long lengths, but really, the joined woods aren't that noticable, and if they are and you do a nice job, people admire your wood woking skills!!! Sooo....if you can find a supplier with long lengths, go for it....If you can't find the lengths that you want, don't sweat it and concentrate on making your joints nice!!!. You won't be disappointed...Juneaudave

John E · Post by **John E** » Fri Sep 17, 2004 8:40 am

Scarf them. I recommend cutting the scarf across the narrow edge of the strip.
This will give more gluing surface than a cut across the thicker part.
Here is a pic of mine ready to glue with an 8:1 scarf.
The strips are 3/8 x 3/4 the 3/8 edge is on the top.

I used epoxy thickened with Fumed Silica just like for my fillets. Pasted it on like peanut butter
then positioned and clamped just hard enough to keep the pieces from shifting. If you leave
the cut edges just a hair proud on the overlap you can sand/plane the joint to almost invisible
after the epoxy cures. I can only tell that it was scarfed because the grain is not a 100% match.
If you book match you might be able to improve but not much.

Rick · Post by **Rick** » Fri Sep 17, 2004 9:57 am

I scarfed up (geez, that term is starting to sound stranger and stranger each time it's repeated) some white pine when it snapped, trial-bending the inwales. White pine's a very uniformly toned wood, with an almost white color - in the canoe, the joint's almost unnoticeable, and with a darker and more strongly grained wood, a well-matched joint would probably be near-invisible.

There are some builders that feel an epoxy joint made with oak will not bond well, because of the acidity in the wood... I personally don't believe this and neiither do the staff at West epoxies, but the chance might still be there, so if, uh, scarfing, mahogany might be the less risky choice, especially for the inwales.

John E · Post by **John E** » Fri Sep 17, 2004 10:43 am

Neglected to say the wood I used was Red Oak. I striped it out of 1x8 finished boards and then sanded to final size using my Fence and a 12 inch disk sander (Don't have a thickness planner) on my Shop Smith Have no problems with the strength of the joint and the scarfs are dead center of the bend on the outwales if they were going to delaminate they are in done in the direction with the most tension on them to do so (See previous picure). I think you just nee to make sure you use a clean joint and use proper gluing and clamping practices.