well i just bought a second router, so to save time I will set them up so that the bead and cover are cut at the same time
my question is, should I mount them so the cutters are side by side (one above the table, one below) or stagger them and mount them both beneath the table.
does it even matter?
Dual router setup for cutting bead and cove
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rabblerouser
- Posts: 26
- Joined: Sat Sep 16, 2006 7:25 pm
Rablerouser,
Whatever is clever... and safe.
Personally, I don't know if I have the kahunas to do a double set-up. I do most o my work by myself and a double setup has another action to look after at the same time. Having said that, many have safely done it. Have a look around this fourm and other forums and you will see many different set-ups.
Good luck.
Snowman
Whatever is clever... and safe.
Personally, I don't know if I have the kahunas to do a double set-up. I do most o my work by myself and a double setup has another action to look after at the same time. Having said that, many have safely done it. Have a look around this fourm and other forums and you will see many different set-ups.
Good luck.
Snowman
Snowman back East
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rabblerouser
- Posts: 26
- Joined: Sat Sep 16, 2006 7:25 pm
If you look on Pg 48 of kaycraft, fig 4-7 you can see that Ted Moores is using 2 routers and a planer in one setup. His are staggered by a good distance, and one is above the table. This doesn't really make sense to me because the closer they are together, the more consistent the final width of the strip (if you didn't plane the face of each board before ripping).
I'm just wondering why his is set up that way?
I'm just wondering why his is set up that way?
Two routers are difficult to set up, one miss adjustment, and the whole strip is ruined.
I use one router. I have better control over the quality of the strips, and the little extra time spent runing strips twice, is only about a half hour!
Simply replace bit, with only a slight adjustment to the fence.
Also run your strips BETWEEN the bit and the fence! This will insure uniformity of the strips.
I also use the same router for my gunnel work without much change over back and forth.
Good luck
Jim
I use one router. I have better control over the quality of the strips, and the little extra time spent runing strips twice, is only about a half hour!
Simply replace bit, with only a slight adjustment to the fence.
Also run your strips BETWEEN the bit and the fence! This will insure uniformity of the strips.
I also use the same router for my gunnel work without much change over back and forth.
Good luck
Jim
Keep your paddle wet and your seat dry!
Dual Router setup
If you are only going to make strips for one canoe, you will have your strips done in two passes by the time it take you to set up and dial in two routers. I have made over 20,000 ft of canoe strips and I do it using two shapers. the reason I use two shapers is that shapers are reversible, so I can have both cutters spinning in the right direction, into the cut. With routers, one of your routers is going to be doing a "climb" cut and cutting in the direction of the feed (if you mount them both flat, cutter up"). It can be done, but make sure you have featherboards in front and back of both cutters to prevent a missile.
Here are a few things that I have learned about one pass bead and cove. You will need at least four, if not five featherboards to keep strips down flush to the table tops and agains the fence in two places, plus one after the last cut (5 to do it right). With this many featherboards, there is a lot of tension and it makes it hard to push the strips through the set up. Buy a set of press down, anti reverse wheels ($35.00) for holding strips down and life will be a bit easier. these have other uses in the shop so they are a good investment. Use featherboards to hold strips against the fence.
Make sure your rough strip ends are square, as you will use one strip to push through the next strip, so you do not have to walk around the setup to pull strips out the other end. If you have to walk around to pull every strip out, then you are not saving any time. Set up an outfield table that is below the surface of your tool table to the strip drops out of the way when it comes out of the second cutter. Periodically check the specs on your strips (every 20 or so) to make sure everything it still in line.
You need to have a way of adjusting the second router, so the distance (thickness of the strip) between the cutters is proper. this is true if you do flat or overhead of the second router. Do not mount them both fixed. This is why I like two shapers. I can set them and adjust them, then tightly clamp them together with C clamps. I seem to always have different widths strips, so I can adjust this setup to varying strip widths.
The idea of mounting the second router overhead it interesting. Impossible with two shapers, but certainly duable with two routers. If you come up with a way of overhead mounting, let us all see a picture. this would allow both cutters to be opposite each other reducing the number of places where the strips has to be held with a featherboard. It would function more like a plane.
Good luck!
Here are a few things that I have learned about one pass bead and cove. You will need at least four, if not five featherboards to keep strips down flush to the table tops and agains the fence in two places, plus one after the last cut (5 to do it right). With this many featherboards, there is a lot of tension and it makes it hard to push the strips through the set up. Buy a set of press down, anti reverse wheels ($35.00) for holding strips down and life will be a bit easier. these have other uses in the shop so they are a good investment. Use featherboards to hold strips against the fence.
Make sure your rough strip ends are square, as you will use one strip to push through the next strip, so you do not have to walk around the setup to pull strips out the other end. If you have to walk around to pull every strip out, then you are not saving any time. Set up an outfield table that is below the surface of your tool table to the strip drops out of the way when it comes out of the second cutter. Periodically check the specs on your strips (every 20 or so) to make sure everything it still in line.
You need to have a way of adjusting the second router, so the distance (thickness of the strip) between the cutters is proper. this is true if you do flat or overhead of the second router. Do not mount them both fixed. This is why I like two shapers. I can set them and adjust them, then tightly clamp them together with C clamps. I seem to always have different widths strips, so I can adjust this setup to varying strip widths.
The idea of mounting the second router overhead it interesting. Impossible with two shapers, but certainly duable with two routers. If you come up with a way of overhead mounting, let us all see a picture. this would allow both cutters to be opposite each other reducing the number of places where the strips has to be held with a featherboard. It would function more like a plane.
Good luck!
Tom
I use 3 feather boards,one to hold the strip down to the table, right where the strip runs "BETWEEN" the bit and the fence, and two featherboards, just inches before and after the bit, to hold the strip against the fence. Make them from scrap wood.
Tension is neccessary, just not too much!
I also place 2 guides to keep the strip parallel to the fence on my infeed and outfeed tables. These tables are simply 6ft. planks with legs, sawhorses if you like.
As for walking back and forth, con a friend to pull ,while you push the strips into this set up, he or she can pull them through! It works for me!
We timed the bead and coving of the strips, that it took for a 17ft MCA Osprey this past Summer, a little over two hours. That's with 2 people.
This whole setup can be made up at a minimal cost !
Good luck!
Jim
I use 3 feather boards,one to hold the strip down to the table, right where the strip runs "BETWEEN" the bit and the fence, and two featherboards, just inches before and after the bit, to hold the strip against the fence. Make them from scrap wood.
Tension is neccessary, just not too much!
I also place 2 guides to keep the strip parallel to the fence on my infeed and outfeed tables. These tables are simply 6ft. planks with legs, sawhorses if you like.
As for walking back and forth, con a friend to pull ,while you push the strips into this set up, he or she can pull them through! It works for me!
We timed the bead and coving of the strips, that it took for a 17ft MCA Osprey this past Summer, a little over two hours. That's with 2 people.
This whole setup can be made up at a minimal cost !
Good luck!
Jim
Keep your paddle wet and your seat dry!
Helper
Jim,
Take away the friend on the back side and you need another featherboard to keep the strip tight to the fence once it clears the featherboard in front of the second cutter, and one to keep it down tight to the work surface. The featherboards in front of the second cutter do not help much once the strip has passed the featherboard, but still engaged with the cutter. If not, you just ruined the strip because it flops around. This is critical with linear feeding, using the next strip to push the one ahead of it through the set up.
When I make strips, they are often for sale to other people. A commercial operation. Usaully 5-10 canoe worth of strips in one run. Ask a friend to help and he gets hurt, you just created a workers compensation liability. I am a one man crew, so every set up that I have has to be functional and efficient with one person. To one pass bead and cove, you need to hold the strip down and tight to the fence before each cutter and after the second cutter to get high quality strips with no snipe in the cove over the last couple of inches of the strip. If you trim your strips at the end, you can trim away any snipe. I sguare cut the boards so I do not have to trim the strips when I am done. Easier to cross cut one board than trim 20 strips.
Take away the friend on the back side and you need another featherboard to keep the strip tight to the fence once it clears the featherboard in front of the second cutter, and one to keep it down tight to the work surface. The featherboards in front of the second cutter do not help much once the strip has passed the featherboard, but still engaged with the cutter. If not, you just ruined the strip because it flops around. This is critical with linear feeding, using the next strip to push the one ahead of it through the set up.
When I make strips, they are often for sale to other people. A commercial operation. Usaully 5-10 canoe worth of strips in one run. Ask a friend to help and he gets hurt, you just created a workers compensation liability. I am a one man crew, so every set up that I have has to be functional and efficient with one person. To one pass bead and cove, you need to hold the strip down and tight to the fence before each cutter and after the second cutter to get high quality strips with no snipe in the cove over the last couple of inches of the strip. If you trim your strips at the end, you can trim away any snipe. I sguare cut the boards so I do not have to trim the strips when I am done. Easier to cross cut one board than trim 20 strips.
two routers
When I made my strips, I made a simple jig to rout both edges at the same time.
It consisted of two 3/4"- approx. 2' square- pieces of plywood with some 1/4" plywood sandwiched between them leaving a slot was left that was as wide as my strips (3/4") running through the center portion. I drilled out 1 3/4" holes through the layer of 3/4" and 1/4" plywood on each side opposing each other but offset so the cutters would miss each other.
Drill holes to mount the routers, put them on, adjust them ( which is pretty easy as you can sight down the slot and see the cutters), make fine depth adjustments, and start cutting.
I used two Freud plunge routers and found it to be very easy and quick to set up the jig. I clamped it to my Table saw table and ripped away. I have used the jig with just one router and doing all of one side and switching bits and routing the other sides and this worked quite well too...if you didn't have two routers to use.
Mike
It consisted of two 3/4"- approx. 2' square- pieces of plywood with some 1/4" plywood sandwiched between them leaving a slot was left that was as wide as my strips (3/4") running through the center portion. I drilled out 1 3/4" holes through the layer of 3/4" and 1/4" plywood on each side opposing each other but offset so the cutters would miss each other.
Drill holes to mount the routers, put them on, adjust them ( which is pretty easy as you can sight down the slot and see the cutters), make fine depth adjustments, and start cutting.
I used two Freud plunge routers and found it to be very easy and quick to set up the jig. I clamped it to my Table saw table and ripped away. I have used the jig with just one router and doing all of one side and switching bits and routing the other sides and this worked quite well too...if you didn't have two routers to use.
Mike
Jim,
Whatever the customer wants. I am fortunate that my shop is in the basement of my house, and I have a tuck under garage adjacent to it. Therefore, if I open my shop door into the garage, I have about 60 ft of indoor space to feed strips, plenty long for even the longest strips and still have everything indoors. This works nice for loading lumber and moving tools into the shop, having them all on the same level as the driveway. To feed 20 ft strips through my set up would take at least 45-50 ft of linear room to get them through from one end to the other. Needless to say the wife's car is out in the driveway during this operation.
I tend to discuorage people from using full length strips, as they are very difficult to transport and work with, and usually lumber is more available and economical in 8-12 ft boards.
Whatever the customer wants. I am fortunate that my shop is in the basement of my house, and I have a tuck under garage adjacent to it. Therefore, if I open my shop door into the garage, I have about 60 ft of indoor space to feed strips, plenty long for even the longest strips and still have everything indoors. This works nice for loading lumber and moving tools into the shop, having them all on the same level as the driveway. To feed 20 ft strips through my set up would take at least 45-50 ft of linear room to get them through from one end to the other. Needless to say the wife's car is out in the driveway during this operation.
I tend to discuorage people from using full length strips, as they are very difficult to transport and work with, and usually lumber is more available and economical in 8-12 ft boards.
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rabblerouser
- Posts: 26
- Joined: Sat Sep 16, 2006 7:25 pm
Re: Dual Router setup
I completely overlooked the direction of the rotation. But nothing wrong with climb cutting. I freehand climb cut all the time to get the smoother cut. They same it's more dangerous, but I have personally experienced no difference. I do make sure to use a very sharp and clean bit though.Tom in MN wrote:If you are only going to make strips for one canoe, you will have your strips done in two passes by the time it take you to set up and dial in two routers. I have made over 20,000 ft of canoe strips and I do it using two shapers. the reason I use two shapers is that shapers are reversible, so I can have both cutters spinning in the right direction, into the cut. With routers, one of your routers is going to be doing a "climb" cut and cutting in the direction of the feed (if you mount them both flat, cutter up"). It can be done, but make sure you have featherboards in front and back of both cutters to prevent a missile.
Here are a few things that I have learned about one pass bead and cove. You will need at least four, if not five featherboards to keep strips down flush to the table tops and agains the fence in two places, plus one after the last cut (5 to do it right). With this many featherboards, there is a lot of tension and it makes it hard to push the strips through the set up. Buy a set of press down, anti reverse wheels ($35.00) for holding strips down and life will be a bit easier. these have other uses in the shop so they are a good investment. Use featherboards to hold strips against the fence.
Make sure your rough strip ends are square, as you will use one strip to push through the next strip, so you do not have to walk around the setup to pull strips out the other end. If you have to walk around to pull every strip out, then you are not saving any time. Set up an outfield table that is below the surface of your tool table to the strip drops out of the way when it comes out of the second cutter. Periodically check the specs on your strips (every 20 or so) to make sure everything it still in line.
You need to have a way of adjusting the second router, so the distance (thickness of the strip) between the cutters is proper. this is true if you do flat or overhead of the second router. Do not mount them both fixed. This is why I like two shapers. I can set them and adjust them, then tightly clamp them together with C clamps. I seem to always have different widths strips, so I can adjust this setup to varying strip widths.
The idea of mounting the second router overhead it interesting. Impossible with two shapers, but certainly duable with two routers. If you come up with a way of overhead mounting, let us all see a picture. this would allow both cutters to be opposite each other reducing the number of places where the strips has to be held with a featherboard. It would function more like a plane.
Good luck!